If he tried to pass healthcare in a way that the majority of americans want it.. he wouldn't have to worry about obstructionist's.

It's no ones fault but his that people are standing in the way.

now lets remember what that nitwit Pelosi said.. 'We will not pass it without a public option'

We'll see about that.

(insert popcorn smiley here)

The same "majority" that elected McCain?

No, the majority that expected Obama to govern based on what he promised while campaigning and that is now finding out just who he and his cronies are and what their agenda is.. exactly why his numbers are flatlining.

...also why the dems HC plan is flatlining, the people are speaking. Do you think if a majority approved of it they would be having this much trouble?

You really think these more centrist dems want to go back home after voting for it and get their asses handed to them for doing so?

I 'm not aruing the source or whether he said it or not. I'm just saying...'So?'

* He has NEVER served time in prison. He was rounded up along with other peaceful protestors and was quickly released and later compesated by the police for the unlawful arrest. This is a fairly easy fact to check, so why does Beck keep peddling it?

* He's not a mysterious 'czar' The  press release announcing his appointment to the White House Council on Environmental Quality. He's a WH staffer.

* Beck keeps insisting he was never vetted. Paterson was called by the FBI during Jones' vetting process.

* The communist quote was taken out of context from a article that makes it clear even in the headline ( "The New Face of Environmentalism" subtitled - Van Jones renounced his rowdy black nationalism on the way toward becoming an influential leader of the new progressive politics") .that he had renounced his youthful radicalism and had found a better way in socially responsible capitalism. *You should read it.

You're the one who defined 'revolutionary' as a code word for 'communism'.

Environmental justice is the movement to ensure that no community suffers disproportionate environmental burdens or goes without enjoying fair environmental benefits."

"It's the environmental racism that allowed the powerful people in society to turn a blind eye for decades to the downsides of the industrial system that got us to this point."

He's right. The big companies spread their money around with the people in power to get the permits and codes changed that they wanted. I wrok for a national company that services all variety's of industry. I see it all the time. From some Mom and Pop restaurant that pays the health inspector to overlook the rats in the basement, to national companies that get codes changed when their retention ponds start getting to toxic. Where do YOU think THAT money goes? To the unemployed in the ghetts?

"Well, the only reason that we have the unsustainable accounting that we have right now is because incinerators, dumping grounds, and sacrifice zones were put where poor people live. It would never have been allowed if you had to put all the incinerators and nasty stuff in rich people's neighborhoods..."

You got that shit right. I've seen them keep hospitals, hospices, prisons, factory's and whatever else they don't want from even getting into the neighborhood. And the ones that pull out...the mess gets cleaned up as opposed to the post-apocolyptic looking crap that they leave behind in the cities and poor areas.

"It's the environmental racism that allowed the powerful people in society to turn a blind eye for decades to the downsides of the industrial system that got us to this point."

And it still continues.

"The other thing is that the environmental justice agenda is also changing. Before, it was much stronger on demanding equal protection from environmental bad. Now we are also demanding equal opportunity and equal access to environmental good."

"We want an equal share, an equitable share, of the work wealth and the benefits of the transition to a green economy."

"....we want to make sure that the green economy is an equal-opportunity, diverse economy that can lift millions of people out of poverty."

"We don't want it to be an ecoapartheid economy where the vast majority of the owners and workers and consumers and beneficiaries of the green economy are all one race."

Why can't this green economy happen in the city's?  What is wrong with bringing these factories and bussiness' back into the city's so the people there can benefit? Why should it only happen in influential areas that have the money to buy these guys dinners, vacations, and cruises? It happens. I keep tryin to tell myself it doesn't, but then another contract comes up for bid and the money starts a flying under the table. The dinners, lunches, meetings at odd hours at odd places.

 "What are some of the policies that you're envisioning would create this more level green-jobs market?"

"It's a two-part answer. First you've got to have a green economy. Then you've got to make it just and inclusive. You've got to put a price on carbon; that's got to be a top priority for the new administration."

What is the problem with putting a price on carbon. IMO, it's flawed in the aspect that these company's will only trade and buy up what they need from each other anyway to skirt around any restrictions .

"The minute the rules change so that we punish the polluters, so the polluters have to pay, and the people who are doing things in a clean and green way are benefited, which can happen within the year, then you're going to see a massive transfer of both public and private capital into the clean and green sector."

The polluters should pay. They should start by paying to have the crap they left behind cleaned up. If you're ever this way, let me know. I can take you to one site that would blow your mind. Even if you didn't buy into anything else I have said here you would see this and say 'They can't do THAT!' and wouldn't shed a tear if they got fined. And that's just one I could show you. They're all over the country.

"We want a really aggressive cap. We want to make the polluters pay. We don't care if they pay by buying permits or paying taxes."

All he's saying is one way or another they are gonna pay for the pollution. EVen if they have to get creative.

"Now, the real question is who's going to get those jobs."

"When the government moves, then capital will move, and when capital moves, then jobs will be created. We want to say very early and very loud, not after we see the big green economic boom, the real boom that's coming, but before, that the jobs question is critical, justice is critical, equal opportunity is critical, and pathways out of poverty are critical."


"We're so clear about this because with the Silicon Valley tech boom, communities of color, poor people got nothing out of it. By the time we got into the argument, to talk about "Let's close the digital divide," the only thing Silicon Valley could think of to do is to give us recycled computers."

"We don't want, having already fought the digital divide in the '90s, to now have to deal with an eco divide."

I really don't know what YOU'RE reading into all of this and what you're so afraid of.

So you're FINALLY willing to come over to my side?!?!? Why I don't know what to say. vstyler must be spitting beer at his monitor.

It's unfortunate that alot of people still suck the governments c**k. When in fact their taking it in the a**.  LOL.

Yep, He renounced his radical ways for a more legitimate way to radical ends

his words Po.

It's serious scary to me that someone who is as obviously smart as you cannot see this guy is a serious radical, a racist and albeit an ex-communist (benefit of the doubt) and further, that you expend so much intellectual energy defending him.

The only conclusion I can draw and I've said it before.. is that.. it just does not bother you.

Oh and love this quote from Jones "Barack Obama is going to save the whole wide world."

  Oh, and i have 'proof' of that.

Care to defend that one?

Like 'revolutionary', another word you want to make seem dirty.

The way this country has been run , refunding programs that don't work, spinning the spin on healthcare reform..anything departing from that would seem radical. It's time for a new appraoch, a departure from the same ol' same ol'.

LIncoln was considered a radical because he sought to transform America by freeing four million slaves.

Martin Luther King was considered a radical becaue he wanted to give them equal rights.

All you see is the face of Mao Tse-Tung in Becks campaign ads.

I have a dream...

All this shows is anger. I don't begin to understand why you, having stated you have no Health Insurance would want to propagate the corrupt existing situation.

Ok..let's say you want that for yourself. Why wish/force it on others?

Secondly, you are all the time claiming this is the President's Health Insurance Plan.

It is not. He has NOT put forward a plan. He left it to the Congress to do.

The only thing that's flatlining is the corrupt politicians who accepted (like Mitch McConnell's 3.7 Million) [money] from the insurance companies.

More so: As more time goes by, more and more inflation occurs so fewer and fewer will be insured.

You're big on free enterprise. How are Health Insurance costs impacting companies? If it cost less, couldn't more be hired? Also, if it weren't Employer based at all, but individual/group/Cooperative based, wouldn't business be better off?

I suppose radical can be a good term, all depends what type of radical a person is.

To me... he's the bad kind.

Thing is.. I'm never going to convince u, or karen, but I bet there are a bunch of fence sitters reading this.. If I can influence one.. all this bs is worth it.

Simple, I'm going to be screwed under either plan. I'm screwed now (under my current circumstances) and if this goes thru I'll be equally screwed,

My family still lives in the UK. They come over every year or so and ALL i hear about is how national healthcare has hit rock bottom over there.... waiting lines, shady physicians being imported from all over the world, people being denied medication because they are 'just too sick' medical mistakes rampant etc etc on and on. Its the same over most of Europe.

This is how I see it.. I'll take my chances, I dont plan on always being poor, one day I will be able to afford healthcare and when and If i do, Id like it to be good healthcare and not some bs system of govt run beauracrats telling who and when to see. My kids have medicaid, its a friggin joke, I've been dealing with crap ass designated doctors,  waiting lines, poor follow up all my kids lives. I'd LOVE to be able to provide better for me and them but I just cannot afford it.

One day , hopefully soon, I will be able to.

The last thing I personally want to see happen is this low level, low quality designated healthcare for everyone.

lastly , as many have said... when congress goes on the SAME PLAN.. I'd vote for it. ( If I could )

Freakin hypocrits.

If its SUCH a great idea\plan.. WHY is it tanking?

I see it as simple, some people just arent going to have healthcare, I've never had insurance, deal with it... get a job, educate urself, work ur asses off, make something of yourselv'es buy good quality healthcare.

So sick of hearing poeple whining about what they havent got while they sit around and do nothing about it.

I realize there is reform needed, Im not saying there isnt, but this age of entitlement makes me ... yes... angry.

People running around yelling 'Death Panel' and the unfortunate people that hear it  tune into Beck to find out what it means instead of somewhere responsible like the NYTimes, possibly?

The logic of that truly escapes me.

Substitute HMO/Insurance Co. high school drop out and that's closer to the truth. Seniors aren't whining about Medicare....that's Gov't run...Medicaid is Gov't run...and my Medicaid patients get good care.

I say the same.

Because instead of trying to improve it, your folks are determined to sink it for petty party concerns...and couldn't care less about 43-46 million uncared for, and ballooning costs. They care more about "winning" via any lie or fear mongering

Wrong. No one should be without it, and it is within reach. You never had insurance? When you were living in Britain? Yeah you did.

The same entitlement that you had growing up? [before coming to the USA]. As for entitlement? You have certain entitlements as a Resident Alien...also, nothing in it will be "free" which is how I sense you mean "entitlement"....or welfare/charity.

v...I truly don't want you to be angry...if I'm making you angry, I'd just as soon stop responding.

Funny, the Times is ALSO tanking.. I suppose that's Becks fault too.

In my adult life. Yes I had healthcare thru the Navy growing up, I had no choice in the matter and cared nought about politics.

I'm entitled to live here as long as I'm alive, no one pays for shit. If there are other entitlements unaware to me... I'm not using them.

What I mean is a culture of entitlement, gimme gimme gimme, something for nothing, laziness, apathy, cradle to the grav'ing

I remember seeing a woman on election night...

"everything gonna be alright now, We got Obama now. Obama's gonna take care of me"

Yeah..that... bothers me... as well it should anyone with an ounce of pride.

Like all print . If I could blame him I would. Unfortunately, the internet is to blame.

So I'll blame Al.